Mick McCarthy has been mooted as a candidate for the Nottingham Forest job after Steve Cotterill was swiftly shown the door by the club’s new owners.
If he does arrive at the City Ground, I think it will be a great fit for both parties. Nobody can deny that Mick has a proven record of putting together Championship outfits that can compete at the summit, particularly when he’s given a few bob to spend. And Forest have massively underachieved, particularly since Billy Davies left the club.
Funnily enough, I’ve been reflecting on our former gaffer a lot this week, comparing his approach to that of our incumbent manager.
It was a a couple of quotes from Ståle Solbakken on the official site that set the cogs in motion. Talking about the issue of man-management, he stated:
“I like to know the players I work with a little bit as people as well. I like to have them close to me but also have the professional distance that you want between a manager and the players.
I like to feel I know them a little bit because then I can get the last five to 10 per cent out of them. It’s about having a good relationship with the players without being a friend.”
McCarthy, I always felt, was too close to the players. This loyalty brought out the very best in them at times, but when it came to making the tough decisions, namely moving players on, it seemed to massively hamper our progress.
Speaking of which, Solbakken employed an equally considered approach when asked about players possibly leaving:
“You have to weigh up that fee with the question of are you strengthening or weakening the football club? And what can you get back for that money on a short-term basis by getting a new player into the club?
Then you have to think how good is the replacement and how quick will he settle in? And what are you selling? Also, how much money are you losing by keeping them? It will probably be a different answer for each of the players.”
This detailed explanation gives me confidence not only that we’ll get an acceptable deal on players that do exit, but also that the team we see take to the field at Elland Road in August will very much be his Wolves side.
Needless to say I’ve enjoyed the more candid, open approach Solbakken has brought to the role and hope this kind of rational dialogue will continue when the season starts and the action intensifies.
I think the fact that Steve Morgan appointed a man who at first glance seems like the complete antithesis of McCarthy must say something about what our chairman perceived to be the shortcomings of his former manager.
Like the rest of us, he’ll be hoping Solbakken’s impressive soundbites off the field translate into a strong performance on it.
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Still lots more questions than answers at the minute, particularly with a squad of 50 odd to trim.
The questions are of a different nature to the ones I had for Mick, so that’s got to be progress!
Namely under Mick:
1. Why play players out of position?
2. Why give certain players significantly more opportunities than others?
3. Why publicly criticise certain players and refuse to apply the same stance to others?
4. Why treat possession with such reckless abandon?
Now under Stale we are asking who is going to move on, what his preferred formation is, who else he’ll be bringing in, how his persona is translated in the media – from the dugout and media room – and how he deals with the muck and nettles of a league he is not accustomed to.
We shall see…
Alright Benny. How were you feeling Sunday morning?
I think Stale’s definitely a 442 man. Hasn’t played anything else at any of his other clubs.
It will definitely be intriguing to see who he culls. Even if the likes of Jarvis and Fletcher move on, you’d imagine he’ll have to be rid of another 6 or 7 minimum if he wants to add others.
I’ve enjoyed some of his other quotes about adopting different styles of play. He already knows some teams will come and park the bus at Molineux and others will be shelling it long. Again it gives me confidence he’s planning for all eventualities.
Early doors I agree, but signs of encouragement. I like a progressive approach.
Head was fine mate. Ended up in a gay bar down Darlington Street, but don’t go telling anyone.
Apart from Henry, Jarvis and Guedioura, there’s no player I’d be too upset to see the back of.
Henry: Because he offers a consistent, 46 game season of around 7/10 – every successful team needs one.
Jarvis: Pace in abundance and the one genuine outlet we have who can shit teams up. Tough to replace
Guedioura: Because I have a nagging suspicion that with games, he can be a very good player for us, as proven against the same opposition next season when with Forest.
For all of Fletcher’s sublime skill and goalscoring ability, I think the Championship is too uncouth and unsubtle for a player of his ilk. IE: Teams get promoted with strikers of a different skill-set (Lambert and Carlton Cole last season for example)
I’d take the cash on him and use it wisely. Doyle can also go for me.
Jarvis on the otherhand…
Do we think hanging onto Jarvis on the cards? I know we’re in a relatively strong position financially so perhaps there’s potential to retain him? What a weapon in the championship he would be!
I’d love us to keep him, but all the noises from Molineux (particularly the official site) point to them softening us up before a deal is announced.
I wouldn’t blame Jarvo, or the club necessarily. He’s been such a selfless, low maintenance team-man.
He used to get dropped for Stephen Ward on the left wing and never complained – I’d have gone apeshit if I was him (after scoring one from a halfway line run and shot against Blackburn, one week before our game at Plymouth in 08!)
I guess the way we view any departures is how you’d view them in your office / work. Have a look around and think which ones are genuniely indispensible.
(As I type on the blog while my boss looks on, I reckon she’s got my number!)
Henry is genuinely indispensible for me. Jarvis mega difficult to replace. Fletcher, I think, could be replaced, in terms of what we need to get us back up.
When it comes to indispensible, only one hero springs to mind……………me.
Without my acerbic humor and rapier wit, you lot would be totally and utterly lost on here!
Who else has the broad shoulders to take the abuse I do?
Who else will go where no one else dares, to say what really needs saying?
And who else has the balls to write, totally without any sort of filtering system, the garbage that continually flows from what passes for a brain in my balding head? ( yes Scooped, it’s going!)
Now, changing the subject with absolutely no apologies whatsoever, and following on from comments on our previous blog thread thingy, I just watched Wolves stuff Man City at Wembley in 1974.
Apart from the fabulous footie we played, the over riding joy I got was Ron Saunders.
He took Norwich to Wembley in 1973, and lost.
He took Man City in 1974, and lost.
He took over at the poorthorns, and GAVE Bully to us.
If ever you want a definition of a loser, it’s him!
We won’t have a say in what Stale does with the players, let’s just give him a chance and see what transpires. I for one feel good for the coming season.
I’m sold, for the time being, on the openness. I think that McCarthy was always reading from his script, and never really let the fans know what was going on. This bloke seems to be very direct.
The only good thing about if McIdiot goes to forrest is he takes TC and the backroom staff with him.pitty they don’t take Poxey as well..Dream on.
The word over here in Nottingham is that the new owners want a manager used to building sides capable of getting promoted out of the Championship, someone who may also be an ex-international manager. Rather makes the list of potential candidates a short one, however MM has the perfect CV and maybe his is the only name in the frame.
Its all conjecture but what exactly the football purists at Forest may make of his more direct style, bizarre tactics, and passing back to the keeper from the kickoff, as compared to the good footballing sides that Cloughie used to create, I don`t know.
Forest are now in a simliar position to Wolves following Hoddle` departure, and maybe MM could work the oracle for another great old club. Hope he gets the job, and has a go with the funds available, maybe a £6m bid is on the way for Doyle, George, Foley, Hunt, and Doherty, we`ll only accept if they take Ward and our old assistant manager as well. Incidentally that values Doyle at £4m, Foley £1m, George £500k, Hunt £450k, Doherty £49999k and Ward at £1.00.
Kills 2 birds with one stone, gets rid of deadwood at the Mol and gets players in at Forest. Oh that this could happen. After complaining about MM and his inept management for some 18 months to my daughter in law and her forest supporting family, it would be the funniest thing for good old Mick to turn up over here.
Im a forest fan excited about our times without Cotterill. My main concern over McCarthy is that he won’t buy Guadiora and Elokobi, who were probably 2 of our best players last season.
Good luck next year.
Whaddya talking bout Willis? Mccarthy LOVES Elokobi… and we know he’ll move mountains for his favourites…. Gedioura however did not really endear himself to mad mick, so i couldnt see him coming in for him, and honestly, I would much prefer to see Adlene stay with us – he is defo an unpolished diamond.
Mad mick is the best guy going to get you up – however then you will need to rethink strategy should you get promoted.
Good article, yes could be a good appointment for us, but I expect a bigger to be honest.
Our new owners seem to be sparing no time on average.
Top blog Thomas, I’ve heard mixed feelings from Forest fans ref MM. Overall the majority i’ve spoken to would welcome his arrival on the basis that he’s been there, done that on more than one occasion.
Closer to home, I’ve not been too upset with the little that i’ve seen from SS so far. Seems like he’s talking sense not spin when asked about possible departures. I wouldn’t be distraught to see Fletcher go for a good price and again with Doyle but out of the two from last seasons showing i feel it more likely that someone would come in for the big man!
I’m with you Ben on Jarvis and Henry, really hope we can keep hold of those 2. Speaking to some forest fans, they would love to get Guedioura off us. They absolutely raved about him from last season and i think he could really do a job for us in the Championship.
I still feel we could strengthen our defence a bit more, most definitely our weak link in my eyes!
Don’t think my boss is quite as kind as yours Ben as i have 2 helicopters wanting to leave right now and the blog takes up 2nd place to their needs!!
UTW!!
I have to agree the comments about MM, especially Bens. He did a great job iniially and got the job done. But then that stubborness crept in and his persistance with some and complete lack of opportunity for others was his downfall. We know Jez called the shots on money and the deals but MM hardly gave some of his own buys a fair chance.
At the moment Stale comments are really all he can sensibly say. Certainly I generally like what he has said so far. My real concern relates to his terms of reference, are we going to see footballing matters constrained by Jez (No financial risk) Moxey or has SM shifted the balance any? No comment on Jez, like it or not well run teams needs someone like him…………but I worry that his over cautious zero finanacial risk approach will stifle any hopes we have of really progressing too far ( mind you right now getting back to the prem will do me). IMHO he is a good bean counter but lacks flair and creativity. I think I detected more hands on from Morgan in the appointment so maybe Stale will have more clout regarding issues. Also encouraging to hear him actually mention money and player values to the team. I dont think Mick was even allowed to mention the word and knew he had to work with whoever Moxey landed for him.
I am encouraged and have a sneaky feeling we will still have all the players Stale wnat to keep.
For sure we have to have a clear out of fringe players. My fear is that TC will get to make these calls or input. I just hope we dont lose potentiol that has not had an opportunity but still thats always likely.
Best of luck to Forest if they get MM, they will need it! –
Mind you their new owners might have enough money to tempt ‘Arry Redknapp !
There are some good teams in the championship.
I am sure there will be some surprises as to who goes and who stays at Molineux.
For me Stale has a clean sheet and I trust whom he thinks should stay or go.
Our new striker who he’s bought for £2m is sure to play, which means striker wise we have far too many and our dodgy defence needs a complete overhaul.
Am more interested in what Stale does than any Olympic competition that’s for sure…
Looking at his soundbites (excellent choice of words Thomas!), he seems to have a very balanced view on things. Another pragmatist rather than emotionalist though. Well, he is a scandy! He will speak just as frankly about the negatives rather than just spin it positively, will be interesting to see whether he keeps this up. I am not surprised that he had problems last year with his players. I’d imagine he’s quite prickly, I think you will find that he will also outcast those who do not train in his thinking just as much as MM did (and all top managers do as well). Its going to be a very principled and disciplined approach. Speaking of which please don’t let Guedioura anywhere near the team! I still think he’s like a poor man’s darron gibson.
Amazing how players divide opinion i saw a lot of Darron Gibson’s appearances for Wolves and thought he was just poor (although he did get stronger back with Man U’s coaching staff).I would like to see Gueidoura given a chance he has more potential than most but still needs to be moulded into team player.
It’ll be interesting if MM goes to Forest, as he has a habit of taking his old players with him (like Gary Breen in his first season at Wolves), we may see the 50 trimmed as yet…
Well he will certainly be spoiled for choice, if he gets it. I have a list he can have for starters.
I wonder what position he will convert Ward into? Goalkeeper??
and what would it say if he bought berra, ward, keogh, edwards et al and took them up and we stayed down??
I picked up on those quotes of Stale earlier Thomas and i find them hugely encouraging. Sensible, logical and, above all, PROFESSIONAL. Huge improvement from the old ‘put a shift in’, ‘Wardy’s been terrific in every game’ type cobblers. It may all go tits up yet but i really am encouraged and excited at the moment.
If MM gets the Forest job, his first two priorities would be Doyle and Henry imo. He can have the former for me(although if he stays Stale will work on his shooting for sure) but i do hope we hang onto Henry. I can also see Hamill blooming under Stale and making up for the loss of Jarvis which is pretty inevitable i would have thought.
The man who i think could be transformed completely is Guedioura. He’s got the lot imo. Power and athleticism, competitvism and a cannon of a shot. Under McCarthy he somehow became a liability. He looked like he had no idea what he was supposed to be doing. And i seem to remember him saying how much he was enjoying it at Forest now they had clear tactics. Pretty damning remark. So he would be one we must hang onto.
Can’t wait to see what happens!
Surely he would take Ward first. I mean he always puts several shifts in, can play everywhere and MM has never said a bad word about him.
I think Guedioura is to me what Ward is to Clive!
“He’s got the lot imo. Power and athleticism, competitvism and a cannon of a shot”.
No, no, no, and no!! He’s an anti-footballer, can’t pass, can’t make decisions. He turns into trouble with the ball and is reckless in trying to win it back. Park football, the only good touch he has is to put his foot through the ball and into row z from 35 yards. Don’t understand it. Too inconsistent, a liability IMO. A headless chicken.
I think you just want him to be better than he is.
Clive, what meds do you recommend for this?
And how many games have you seen him play to form that opinion? Ward has had hundreds! I take it Forest fans are all wrong then?
Honest question now. Why form such an extreme view on a player who has never been given a chance (I mean a run of up to 6 games in his correct position)
Is your viewpoint so entrenched you refuse to entertain the notion of ‘fairness’ or are you really that fickle?
I bet you’d have dropped that useless Graeme Gooch after his King Pair on debut?
He only made 4 appearances last season!! Anti-footballer?! Viva Dave fucking Edwards
El Plim, try to remember his performance against Spurs on a freezing February night in 2010(long before Merlin’s coaching and selection expertise had weaved it’s full magic). It was sublime in almost every respect and played a huge part in completing the double over a team who finished fourth, if memory serves.
As time went by under the McCarthy regime, i agree, he gradually deteriorated until he did become a bit of a liability(as my post said, if you read it).
What i was saying was this is a man with the raw talent, physique and competitiveness who could achieve almost anything with the right guidance and oppurtunity.Transformed was the word iused. How many of our team could ever score a thunderbolt from 30 yds as he has done both for us and for Forest more than once.
And Ben makes a good point about how well he has played for Forest and what their fans think of him.
My only fear is that we will let him go and never find out.
You would think so wouldn’t you? But i reckon deep down even McCarthy knows he’s shit. Not coming in for him is a lot easier than leaving him out of the side. It will be interesting to see if there is any interest in Ward from anyone at all. If there isn’t any (for a man who was a first choice premiership player all season) it will be more proof, if we needed any, that his continued selection was a very strange one.
Agreed Martin there was something very spooky about it. I respect Ward, he plays his heart out and sometimes looks good going forward but he just is not, never was and never will be a Left Back.
I really think Cotterill has been shafted, it would just rub salt in if he has been fired for MM to step in. Although I am one of those who recognizes his ability to build a Championship promotion team.
There was an interesting article in what passes for a newspaper in Houston this morning.
It said that ” Iker Casillas, one of the greatest goalkeepers in the history of soccer” will make a special visit to Houston..blah, blah blah.
So that puts him up there with Gordon Banks, Yashin, Peter Schmeichel etc etc?
To me a goalie only gets good when he has a lot to do, and with Spain in front of him, Casillas has time to read the paper, have a coffee, snooze a bit and take the occassional goal kick.
I would nominate our own Wayne Hennessey as a much better keeper, certainly much busier, fitter, with all that bending over picking up the ball from the back of the net, and much stronger, having to stomach all the shit in front of him week after week. He will have much stronger vocal chords also, with all that screaming at the deaf dummies in front of him, not to mention his superior vampire qualities, as he is scared of crosses.
The old ones are the best!!
FOWB
Clive,
You really crack me up with your humour. By the way I agree.
My big problem up here in Upstate NY is how am I going to see my babies this coming season. Do you have any info. on who will be showing what ir will we have to settle for occasional appearance on Championship Soccer.
I think we can resign ourselves to losing Jarvo, Fletch and O’Hara, (sadly), Johnson (hopefully) and Griffiths (almost certainly).
I also hope that amongst the DVD’s he checked, SS managed to obtain one or two of Guedioura in a Forest shirt as some of his performances showed what an asset he could be in the Championship. So that would be a few quid saved…
Not so sure we will losetoo many good guys. Just have a sneaking gut feel.
Agree about GOODioura, lets hope he also watched some from previous year befor his leg injury. When I thought AG was developing nicely and settling into the team. Maybe Stale decided to have a look at our more succesful season when we escaped narrowly on the last day.
If he watched all of last season’s DVd’s, then he would have to be a real masochist to want to see previous years.
I too am resigned to not seeing the lads live next season, relying on newspaper (electronic) reports, phone conversations with Scooped and Mark G Davies, and the usual unbiased comments on the blog, from the likes of Ben, Thomas and that master of rose coloredisms, our Louie!!
Maybe we will not have such a miserable life for the coming 9 months if we are not subjected to the shit we had to endure last season?
At least my dogs can change their occupations.
Last season they were blacksmiths, coz every time the Wolves lost they knew they were going to get a kick up the arse, so they made a bolt for the door.
Once again, the old ones are the best!
FOWB
Clive,
I have a good techy friend who seems able to stream anything he wants. If he gets a good link for me I will let you know.
My dog has a Wolves Collar, even she was slinking around all embarrassed last season.
I agree after three years of struggle and excuses. It will be good to see us kick arse again. A win is a win wherever we are.
I’m gonna report you to the SPCA.
That is really cruel making yer dawg wear a Wolves collar.
My missus has to bear even more, Wolves shot glasses, coffee mugs, coasters, pictures, teddy bears, cushions, and even my company logo on my truck bears an uncanny resemblance to a certain type of Wolf head!
If greasel reads this I’m sure he’ll send someone over to take pix, and then sue me!
Yep, We are the same . My home office is full of the stuff. Coats mugs the lot. All my Grandsons are indoctrinated got the gear and did home made Wolves cards for fathers day. I wonder if Moxey realizes the real intensity of Wolves supporters. There is obvioulsy a part of Houston that is forever Wolves and a dynasty up here in Rochester and Buffalo. Once a Wolfie always a Wolfie.
Supported them since mid 50s and it aint gonna change now.
Did you ever watch the movie ” Formula 51″?
Fabulous line where the mother is asked “what kind of idiot jumps into bed yelling come on you reds?”
When she saw the film for the first time, my wife said ” I cant believe there’s more of them out there like you. That’s why you yell “Come You Wolves” all the time!”
Ha.
These Americans will never understand.
Shame to hear about Jody, either the old buggar has really lost it or Stale is super confident in Danny or being able to bring in some one good. Or the incumbents got real good during the last month or two.
Again though I like the upfront style and that they are going to try to do something for Jody during his tough time. Clear out some rubbish and surely he must have something to offer as a defensive coach, by God we need it.
I think we all knew time had caught up with him, but I for one always felt better in recent years with him playing rather than his replacements. Lets not forget the odd goals he scored at critical times.
Good Luck Jody, you wore that shirt with pride and honor.
My home office is full of the stuff. Coats mugs the lot. All my Grandsons are indoctrinated got the gear and did home made Wolves cards for fathers day. I wonder if Moxey realizes the real intensity of Wolves supporters. There is obvioulsy a part of Houston that is forever Wolves and a dynasty up here in Rochester and Buffalo. Once a Wolfie always a Wolfie.
Supported them since mid 50s and it aint gonna change now.
MM now clear favourite for the Forest job if he gets it looks like he will have a lot of money to spend – who will he come back for and who will want to go ? This could really spice things up.
Looks like Stale now realises the daunting task ahead – whitiling down a squad of 50 professionals when there is not much to choose between 40 of them.Just hope we dont let all the younger players go.
MM close to clinching Forest job.
Just tried to look at the Official sanitized site.
It’s been changed, and is now the worst site out there on the web, of any site, ever devised, by anyone about anything.
Guess greasel has his sticky fingers all over it, ads for this, that and the other taking up more room than anything pretending to be news.
Ad look at the picture of TC with our new manager.
Anything more subserviant I’ve yet to see.
Roll on the season, it’s boring right now!!
FOWB
Hey, I like it! 😛 And is that you on the picture ‘cos I always imagined you with a scar on the right side of your face, a great big bushy brown beard your face and a with crooked walking stick…dunno why! 😛
Apparently Mick has turned Forest down…
Yeh,thats a pity Mc Idiot did’nt get the forest job,looks like TC is staying for a bit longer.
Just watched Wolves beat Forest in the League Cup Final of 1980.
Hers some quizzy type questions for you fellow old farts, and no cheating online either!
1. Which Wolves players from that 1980 team also played for Wolves in the 1974 League Cup winning team?
2. Which other 1974 player would have played, but for an injury?
3. What was that injury?
4. Which Forest player is now a highly regarded Premier Manager?
5. How many 1 million pound players were on the pitch that day?
6. Who was the Wolves unused sub?
And PS
if Viv Anderson tackled John Richards today like he did after 5 minutes of that match, he would have been red carded and banned for at least 5 games.
Not clear that MM has ruled himself out for the Forest job – I have got mixed feelings afterall Mc idiot’s championship record is,playoffs,champions,playoffs,7th,champions.
Welcome back, Thomas!! Your blogs are like busses. Anyway, Thomas’ Lord Lucan impressions aside, I’ve been sitting quietly assimilating my thoughts since the season ended. And, amazingly, the new season is nearly upon us (I’m sure the summer break gets shorter every year).
So…where do we go? What are my wishes for the season?
Firstly, I hope that people start giving Super Mick a bit of a break. The “Mad Mick” (and worse) comments are wearing thin now. He started with nothing, got us promoted and kept us up twice. He lost the plot at the end, but most managers do. Lest we forget (and I’m in no way comparing the two) Brian Clough’s last season in charge of Notts Forest ended in relegation. Let’s please give Mick a break. He deserves more respect than he’s getting and, for some of the comments, people should be ashamed.
Anyway, that little moan aside, I like the Solbakken appointment and Johan Lange seems to have a decent reputation from what people are saying. As for signings…Tank is one for the future (but I hope he is actually brought through at some stage), Sigurdarson seems a good signing but you never know until they’ve got some games under their belts. As for Nouble, I’m less than convinced but he’s only young and hasn’t really settled at a club yet, so you never know…he could be a revelation!!
I’ve heard murmurings (and some shoutings) about a total rebuild. I don’t think that’s strictly true. We need to clear some out, without a doubt, but I don’t think wholesale changes are necessary. A centre back, possibly a left back, a centre midfielder possibly…although these needs could change if players go.
I’m looking forward to it. It should be a good laugh, the Championship always is. We shouldn’t be settling for mid-table as some are suggesting, though. Play-offs has to be a minimum. So here we go again…back in “Division One” as I’ll always see it. And, my, how we’ve missed it!!
Are you greasel in disguise?
Looking forward to life in the second division, amongst the has beens, wannabees and never will bees?
If we don’t have wholesale changes then that useless lot who got us relegated will still be around, with the “backroom staff “, and Connor.
Wake up.
Playoffs a minimum?
Only automatic promotion is acceptable!
Why should we be thinking second best is good enough?
Enough of living in the past, forget McDickwadhead, he’s long gone, along with all our ex managers, good bad and Hoddle. No one wishes ill to the numptiehater, but good riddance.
Let’s get behind the new guys and give our full support to our team, and get us back in the Prem at the first attempt, so we can enjoy taking the piss out of the likes of Rooney, Terry, and countless others.
FOWB
“Division One”? It used to be Div 2 and now it’s called the championship. I don’t get that.
Two responses!!
Martin – I was born in 1988, so I don’t remember it being Div 2. It’ll always be Div 1 to me.
Clive – Clive, Clive, Clive. Can’t we just be friends? Don’t you know we have a ‘special relationship’ across the Atlantic?!! I jest, of course. We’re all friends on here.
I’m certainly not Moxey in disguise…My frame hasn’t the girth to disguise him.
I look forward to the Championship because I’ve seen every Wolves home game this season and I’ve not witnessed a win since December.
I like the Championship as it now is. If I didn’t, I wouldn’t be a Wolves fan. I was brought up on mid-90s Division 1 football. I like the Championship and respect it as a highly competitive league. It’s one of the reasons we’ve got the best league in the world in England. Many Championship teams could hold their own in the top leagues across Europe, and destroy the 2nd tier leagues across Europe.
Don’t forget, in terms of automatic promotion, there’s maybe 10 teams who’ll want that. Play-offs? Minimum. Automatic? Well, that’d be just peachy.
I still don’t think wholesale changes are necessary. Evolution, not revolution.
I’m not living in the past. I just want McCarthy to get the gratitude he deserves. It was time for him to go, but let’s not forget all he did before the 5-1 loss.
As for getting behind them, I always am. Rain or shine with a season ticket for 17 years.